Tolkien, languages and unrelated stuff
Aug. 28th, 2023 07:51 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
wiseheartJust so that you folks get something else to read than my domestic whining...
I was thinking about how different some things sound in different languages, even if the words itself have the exact same meaning. Since Tolkien was a master of words (and languages), I'll take the examples from "The Hobbit" - and because those are the names/words/expressions I've often mused about since I first read "The Hobbit", back in 1980 or so. Yes, it came late to us. We lived behind the Iron Curtain, after all.
I'm comparing two examples in three languages - well, I wanted to make three, and in the early morning I even remembered the third one, but since then the heat burned it out of my mind. I'll add it later, should it resurface, but I won't put my hopes high about that. And yeah, of the remaining two, there is one that will be only in two languages because I have no idea where I put my German edition, and I simply forgot how they translated that particular phrase.
Anyway, the first one is the Misty Mountains. In my foreign ears, the English original doesn't sound too interesting. My German edition called them die Nebelgebirge, which is found slightly more mythic. The original Hungarian edition called them a Ködös Hegyek, which is the exact translation of the English original and not very exciting, either. But then the Hungarian translation of LotR calls them Ködhegység, which you could probably translate as "the mountains of mist", which blew me away the moment I first saw it. I regret that I can't produce an audio sample; the word has such a mythical quality, with inside echoes - that sounds a bit odd, but I can't describe it any better. As soon as I read that word, I knew exactly what the Misty Mountains should look like... decades before PJ's version.
Of course, the names in the Hungarian version of LotR were created by a poet, who died shortly after creating them and beginning the translation, so it probably isn't surprising.
The other one is Elrond's description from The Hobbit, where it was said he was "as kind as summer". I really like that expression in the original. Alas, I can't remember how it was translated into German, but in Hungarian it says "nyájas, mint a nyár". Again, it is a very exact translation, but with a swing to the sound that is unique. Alliterations help, too. So yeah, our translators did a nice job with the Professor's work.
Returning to more mundane topics, I've finished the felt songbook. Sewing in all the pages and making the spine was a gargantuan task; at one point I had to stitch through eight layers, but at least I know now what I'll do differently with the second one. I hope I'll still remember when I get there. But it is done now, and I'm incredibly relieved. My poor fingers are lobbying for a short break, so I might take a day or two off. Not more, though, as the Christmas fair will come in three and a half months, and that is less time than non-crafty people might think. ;))
I was thinking about how different some things sound in different languages, even if the words itself have the exact same meaning. Since Tolkien was a master of words (and languages), I'll take the examples from "The Hobbit" - and because those are the names/words/expressions I've often mused about since I first read "The Hobbit", back in 1980 or so. Yes, it came late to us. We lived behind the Iron Curtain, after all.
I'm comparing two examples in three languages - well, I wanted to make three, and in the early morning I even remembered the third one, but since then the heat burned it out of my mind. I'll add it later, should it resurface, but I won't put my hopes high about that. And yeah, of the remaining two, there is one that will be only in two languages because I have no idea where I put my German edition, and I simply forgot how they translated that particular phrase.
Anyway, the first one is the Misty Mountains. In my foreign ears, the English original doesn't sound too interesting. My German edition called them die Nebelgebirge, which is found slightly more mythic. The original Hungarian edition called them a Ködös Hegyek, which is the exact translation of the English original and not very exciting, either. But then the Hungarian translation of LotR calls them Ködhegység, which you could probably translate as "the mountains of mist", which blew me away the moment I first saw it. I regret that I can't produce an audio sample; the word has such a mythical quality, with inside echoes - that sounds a bit odd, but I can't describe it any better. As soon as I read that word, I knew exactly what the Misty Mountains should look like... decades before PJ's version.
Of course, the names in the Hungarian version of LotR were created by a poet, who died shortly after creating them and beginning the translation, so it probably isn't surprising.
The other one is Elrond's description from The Hobbit, where it was said he was "as kind as summer". I really like that expression in the original. Alas, I can't remember how it was translated into German, but in Hungarian it says "nyájas, mint a nyár". Again, it is a very exact translation, but with a swing to the sound that is unique. Alliterations help, too. So yeah, our translators did a nice job with the Professor's work.
Returning to more mundane topics, I've finished the felt songbook. Sewing in all the pages and making the spine was a gargantuan task; at one point I had to stitch through eight layers, but at least I know now what I'll do differently with the second one. I hope I'll still remember when I get there. But it is done now, and I'm incredibly relieved. My poor fingers are lobbying for a short break, so I might take a day or two off. Not more, though, as the Christmas fair will come in three and a half months, and that is less time than non-crafty people might think. ;))
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(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-28 06:34 pm (UTC)I know JRR got a lot of his ideas from Nordic mythology.
(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-28 07:32 pm (UTC)Now I'd like to know what the German translation said, but I don't have a German copy.
(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-28 11:01 pm (UTC)Interesting. To me, 'The Misty Mountains' does sound interesting. On the other hand, summer is not kind here, so that one is odd to me. lol
(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-29 09:14 am (UTC)Since watching a lot of Chinese TV I have become fascinated by translations. Sometimes I can translate a phrase and realise that actually, that is not what the English subtitles on screen are saying. I also came to the rather late realisation that some concepts or words simply do not have a word-for-word translation capability. This may sound naïve, but as a girl who only ever had schoolgirl French, that had never occurred to me before.
(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-29 03:35 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-29 05:11 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-29 05:12 pm (UTC)Übrigens danke für die Rätselhefte. Das war sehr lieb von Dir!
(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-29 05:15 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-29 05:16 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-29 05:17 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-29 05:28 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2023-08-29 07:05 pm (UTC)Gern geschehen :)