wiseheart | Essay: The Steward's Family

I have read your essay and I think it has many well-worked out arguments. I will think up a coherent and logical response later but for now, let me say, that there were quite a few points where I was going "Exactly!" but also some where I was going "But, but he didn't..." You can guess them, I think ;).

Nice to hear the anylytical side of your Tolkien muse is still alive, though :) *hugs*

Not just the analytical side, in fact. After all, I posted two new chapters to "The Shoemaker's Daughter", just before I went to Cambridge. *g*

Yes, I do agree with much of this! In fact, I see some of your excellent reasoning reflected in the views of Isabeau's OC, Andrahar (whom I adore!). The time in which JRRT was working was one in which less precision was expected and accepted. Tolkein was not writing with all the resources we now have available. He was working with hardcopy - and manuscript hardcopy at that - and memory as his primary sources. We have the luxury of internet, hundreds of people to bounce our ideas off of, printed and easily accessible texts of his works, and the concept of 'canon' from which to work. I think in his mind, the world was more fluid than it is in ours. I also think that in his mind LOTR was less a book and more legend that he was setting down for future generations. If you reread the preface to LOTR, he comes across as somewhat bemused at how seriously people take the whole thing.

Tolkein didn't spend much time (if ANY) psychoanalizing the characters, worrying about whether or not Aragorn was violating principles of good leadership, or debating whether Finduilas died as a result of DV or from cancer, but rather he was concerned about moving his narrative forward. Boromir had to die in order for the company to split and force Frodo to go to Mordor alone with Sam. Finduilas had to die because she couldn't be present to be a grounding point in Denethor's life at the time of the Ring War. The Palantir had to be in use to drive Denethor to madness so that he would not live to foster a civil war at the start of Aragorn's reign (the same could be said of Boromir's death). It's a plot device, not a character flaw. I always thought Boromir got shafted.

Agreed. I think this psychoanalizing everything to death is a modern weakness in us, readers. We just can't get out of all that angsting that rules our modern lives, I guess.

The "Éowyn the deserter" outcry spawned from the same source, IMO. I don't remember any of the Rohirrim having a problem with Éowyn leaving Dunharg and going to battle. They seemed to find that the most logical behavior a warrior of the Mark could have. Éomer wasn't willing to stand behind, either (although at least he was asked, unlike his sister).

The only one who was upset about her presence was Éomer himself, and most likely because he was afraid to lose her, and for no other reason.

And yes, Boromir most definitely got shafter. What's interesting, I never found it so in my forgotten youth when reading the books. It took me the (by me heavily disliked) movies and an excellent Sean Bean to see his POV in this whole situation.

On the Eowyn deserter thing...I never even considered that she might be seen as such on reading it initially thirty-odd years ago. Now I can certainly see that from the perspective of those who she should have been taking care of though. After all, as a member of the house of Eorl, she had a job to do even though it wasn't one that she would rather have had another job. Royals simply don't get to chose! I'm quite a bit harder on her as an adult than I was as a teenager. She acted in a selfish, immature way, and if I were her parent, I'd have some seriously harsh words for her.

We also don't really SEE any of the Rohirrim other than Eomer after the battle on the Pelennor (other than the description of Theoden's funeral). So speculation about what they actually thought about Eowyn is just that. I guess we are free to project whatever we want upon them since there simply isn't canon in this space. Great! More wiggle-room for fanfic writers

In the Éowyn thing, I believe I must disagree. We are way too used to see things from the US Marines point of view. LOTR is a tale about heroes, and heroes have the freedom of genre to behave differently. Otherwise Boromir wouldn't have been such an idiot to start a journey to an unknown location alone. For that, he was much too important a person.

But Tolkien was using the legend motiv of a lonely hero going on a quest, not writing a story about military intelligence. We should measure Éowyn the same way we measure the males. It always make me sad that it's usually women who try to make the only female hero of the entire trilogy look bad.

OK, stream of consciousness here...

Boromir was given the task by his ruler. Eowyn, given a task by her ruler, chose not to do it. I don't think it's a gender thing (at least not for me).

I'm trying to think of another example where a character, either female OR male, was given a task and chose not to take it up in favor of doing what they wanted. Can you think of more?

The only one I remember is Beregond - he left his post against the orders of Denethor, and, like Eowyn, the result was positive (Faramir was saved), yet he there had to be a penalty for disobeying his ruler so was stripped of his rank of tower guard and sent from the city. In his case, justice was tempered with mercy and he was assigned to guard the man whose life he saved in Faramir's newly formed White Company in Ithilien. We don't see similar judgement - if it happened - in Eowyn's case, so we don't know what the Rohirrim thought! Logically, Eomer, as the king, should have judged in her case as Aragorn did in Beregond's. Right?

I'm not as canon-literate as I'd like to be and would love to find other examples and see what Tolkein does with them as well.

I'm not as canon-literate as I would to be either, but IIRC, Éowyn did do her task, at least partially. Quite frankly, I never made much thought about the whole thing, until a few years ago someone came up with the "deserter" thing.

It made me unbelievably angry, to be honest. Éowyn was my first - and to date still the only - fantasy heroine, and I took it a bit personally, I think. I still do. There are so very few female heroes who can kick ass and save the day (which she did on the Pelennor), and people still need to bash the ones we actually have.

Okay, deep breaths... The other one who acted against his King's orders was actually Éomer, pursuing the Orcs without Théoden's leave. Granted, Théoden was a bit of a dotard at that time, but when we really want to apply modern terms to legendary heroes, he must have been court-martialed for that. Yes, I know he got thrown into the brig or whatnot, for a short while (not exiled as PJ came up with the idiotic version). But everybody else and the reader was completely OK with his cowboy actions because the result, as you said, was positive.

BTW, Faramir acted against Denethor's orders, too, when letting Frodo and Sam go. And Denethor certainly wasn't pleased.

Ummm... I managed to lose coherence somewhere along the way. This is the result of the "protect Éowyn's good name" instinct, most likely. *g*

Good examples. Soooo... Eomer got chucked in the dungeons (or whatever there were in Meduseld). Faramir got smacked upside the head, railed at in Council and sent back out to die defending Osgiliath when Denethor KNEW it was going to fall. Both could have been patted on the head and told that, since they were the last surviving heir, they were going to be pardonned but don't do it again... Nope, they both got spanked for disobeying orders. Normal order of medieval-ness upheld. I don't want Eowyn bashed, I just want consistency. Of course, I'm that way as a manager too...don't tell me it's OK for a man to get away with X if a woman would get censured for it OR the other way around! It's *NOT* OK! Of course, in Middle Earth or the Middle Ages, there was no equality. So whatever my opinion, it's revisionist at best and probably more like heretical.

Oh, I do agree with you about the same treatment thing. And would LOTR take place in real medieval settings, I think Éowyn would be sent to a cloister, should she try to pull a stung like that.

However, and it's just my opinion, the whole thing has more common with folk tales than with real medieval history. Folk tales are full of princesses who dress up like men, go into battle and save the day by killing a foe that couldn't be killed by "mere" men. Personally, I don't think that looking at a folk tale motiv in the light of modern - or even medieval - military politics is the right thing to do. It's simply a different genre.

Which takes us back to a common fanon misunderstanding, I think. LOTR has semi-medieval settings. It's a fantasy tale, not a medieval mystery like the Cadfael Chronicles (excellent stuff, should you not know it, I'd warmly recommend reading them). Fantasy works with motivs from fairy and folk tales and old legends.

In a legend, a hero (Boromir) can go on a lonely quest. In a proper medieval setting, the son and heir of the ruler would be sent out with a strong escort to keep him safe, whatever the goal of his journey was. In a folk tale, a princess can disguise herself as a young knight and slay the monster that is unkillable to men, In a medieval setting, she'd be sent to a cloister or locked away in a remote caste.

Okay, I'm belabouring the point, as usual. It's just so that I really don't like when real life criteria are applied to fantasy or to a fairy tale. For me, the two aspects just don't mix. After all, we're not chasing dragons in our back yard, either (well, not the sane ones of us anyway). *g*

Cyberspace ate my reply at Otherworlds.*sulks*

But I enjoyed the essay, and agree throughly with you on all of it.

Thanks. :)
And yes, Cyberspace is evil!

Essay: The Steward's Family

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